How do you feel about vibrato?
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@Kehaulani Vibrato became an issue when orchestras started playing more loudly. The model is the human voice and as long as we stay at historical "chamber" music levels, it is possible to sing with minimum vibrato. Approach operatic levels and there is no choice. As far as timetables go, the beginnings of recorded music shows use of substantial vibrato - check out the cornet recordings of Vincent Bach or Herbert Clarke. Vibrato a plenty was popular in American orchestras until the early 70s. Maurice André used more than noticable quantities - as did the trumpeters from the Philadelphia, Cleveland and Chicago symphony orchestras. Timofei Dokschitzer had a wonderful vibrato on just about everything that he played. Starting with the late 70s, the aestethics changed. Less became more.
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I read about instrumental vibrato imitating the human voice, but who's to say that the voice used little or copious vibrato?
What the human voice does is often put into the context of modern reflection. But who is to say that vibrato is natural to the human voice?
Benge 3X
Martin Committee
Getzen Capri Cornet
Adams F-1 Flugelhorn"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn."
Charlie Parker"Even if I could play like Wynton Marsalis, I wouldn't play like Wynton Marsalis."
Chet Baker -
@ROWUK said in How do you feel about vibrato?:
@Kehaulani Vibrato became an issue when orchestras started playing more loudly. The model is the human voice and as long as we stay at historical "chamber" music levels, it is possible to sing with minimum vibrato. Approach operatic levels and there is no choice. As far as timetables go, the beginnings of recorded music shows use of substantial vibrato - check out the cornet recordings of Vincent Bach or Herbert Clarke. Vibrato a plenty was popular in American orchestras until the early 70s. Maurice André used more than noticable quantities - as did the trumpeters from the Philadelphia, Cleveland and Chicago symphony orchestras. Timofei Dokschitzer had a wonderful vibrato on just about everything that he played. Starting with the late 70s, the aestethics changed. Less became more.
Not sure how I feel about the loudness competition. Something gets lost.
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@FranklinD said in How do you feel about vibrato?:
@Tobylou8 I don't think it makes any sense to discuss words. If it will be called 'style' it's in my opinion an ugly style, still copied from Armstrong in the wrong way.
I'm not saying you're right or wrong. I'm just pointing out that's how he played throughout his long career. Is it everyone's cup of tea? No, and that's okay too.
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@Kehaulani said in How do you feel about vibrato?:
I read about instrumental vibrato imitating the human voice, but who's to say that the voice used little or copious vibrato?
What the human voice does is often put into the context of modern reflection. But who is to say that vibrato is natural to the human voice?
My voice teacher from decades ago said it was not natural unless one had poor breath control! She preached the "Circle of Breath" 25+ years ago!
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That's sort of like asking: "How do you feel about Brussels sprouts?" Well prepared and in moderation: Great! Poorly prepared and in excess: Barf!
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@Tobylou8 said in How do you feel about vibrato?:
My voice teacher from decades ago said it was not natural unless one had poor breath control! She preached the "Circle of Breath" 25+ years ago!
In listening to Timofei Dokschitzer, I can safely say he does not have poor breath control. And I would say sets an amazing example of "Circle of Breath". Perhaps, just perhaps, your voice teacher was giving you a lot of vibrato?!
Allora Pocket Trumpet 2014
Harrelson Summit 2017
Kanstul 1526 2012
Getzen Power Bore 1961
Getzen Eterna 4-Valve Fulgelhorn 1974
Martin Committee 1946
Olds Super Recording 1940
Olds Recording (LA) 1953
Olds Recording (Fullerton) 1967
Olds Ambassador 1965 -
When I sing, vibrato is involuntary. To not have vibrato while singing takes a great deal of concentration. When I play trumpet it is almost always intentional and I have to make it happen in various ways.
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@Newell-Post said in How do you feel about vibrato?:
"How do you feel about Brussels sprouts?"With my fingers...
...and then throw them directly into the trash as to me they taste horrible no matter how they are prepared, or how much beer and wine I have had before inserting on of those suckers into my mouth.
Allora Pocket Trumpet 2014
Harrelson Summit 2017
Kanstul 1526 2012
Getzen Power Bore 1961
Getzen Eterna 4-Valve Fulgelhorn 1974
Martin Committee 1946
Olds Super Recording 1940
Olds Recording (LA) 1953
Olds Recording (Fullerton) 1967
Olds Ambassador 1965 -
@Dr-GO said in How do you feel about vibrato?:
@Tobylou8 said in How do you feel about vibrato?:
My voice teacher from decades ago said it was not natural unless one had poor breath control! She preached the "Circle of Breath" 25+ years ago!
In listening to Timofei Dokschitzer, I can safely say he does not have poor breath control. And I would say sets an amazing example of "Circle of Breath". Perhaps, just perhaps, your voice teacher was giving you a lot of vibrato?!
Not a chance. She was talking about singing. Vibrato isn't natural is the point even for Timofei (who's MAGNIFICENT!!).
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You folks are still using contemporary and personal preferences. I am asking for tangible, original sources.
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LOL. Well when I was a kid Mom would buy the frozen brick of Brussels sprouts from the A&P, take them home, and boil them for 2 or 3 hours. That produced a concoction with the taste and texture of pond scum garnished with sulphur. But have you ever had them sliced and sauteed in butter and olive oil with garlic, bacon bits, and sea salt? The latter is nothing at all like the former.
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@FranklinD Phil McCann came from the British Brass Band tradition... and plaed cornet.
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@FranklinD said in How do you feel about vibrato?:
Sorry, that's all there is...
Well, I don't believe there is. There must be historical commentaries on vibrato performance practices of their time. Assumingly, no one on this board knows about them. That ignorance (not meant condescendenly, I don't know, either) does not trump historical sources and research.
Benge 3X
Martin Committee
Getzen Capri Cornet
Adams F-1 Flugelhorn"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn."
Charlie Parker"Even if I could play like Wynton Marsalis, I wouldn't play like Wynton Marsalis."
Chet Baker -
@Kehaulani said in How do you feel about vibrato?:
Well, I don't believe there is. There must be historical commentaries on vibrato performance practices of their time. Assumingly, no one on this board knows about them. That ignorance (not meant condescendenly, I don't know, either) does not trump historical sources and research.
https://www.earlymusicamerica.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/VibratoWars-1.pdf
http://www.classicstoday.com/features/ClassicsToday-Vibrato.pdf
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Oh, man, how cool. Thanks, Shifty.
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https://www.york.ac.uk/music/conferences/nema/bethell/ is all about vibrato.
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Relating to jazz trumpet here is an interview in which Clifford Brown is asked about the lack of vibrato in "modern" playing. That question is at about 1:40.
