Here is a link to Jack Kanstul's Facebook page dated July 22. It states "We still have mouthpieces". Give the contact information a try and see if the G-2 is still available. Good luck with this link. Do let me know if you get the mouthpiece.
https://www.facebook.com/kanstulfactory/posts/2640086589358746?comment_id=2640124689354936
Thanks Dr. Mark for illustrating my point. What you forgot to identify on the picture is the focus on the facial contours of the actual muscles in use. As for the corner of the lips, that is soft tissue that is compressed by the mouthpiece so will not turn up unless I take the mouthpiece away. If I did, and kept the embouchure intact, you would then see the corners go up. Try this yourself in a mirror and you will see this happen. Also if you continue to blow when you do this, you will hear "Phwooooo" (not buzz).
Now lets look at the picture with more detail:
Focus your attention on the blue circles under my eyes. There is a shine from the spot light above. That is because that part of my cheeks are rounded off by the vertical smile. Look just lateral to the circle. The shine goes away. That is the point where the muscle insertion to the zygimatic arch ends.
Now focus on the red circle that tracks the muscle that attaches to the jaw for the traditional horizontal smile that creates the buzz. If those muscles were in play, the creases to my cheeks would flatten in that plane. Clearly you can see in within the red circle, the creases are intact. Hence. no lateral smile muscle use. It is all vertical.
Thanks again for proving my point.
@Kehaulani said in attn: Dr GO ref "G" mouthpieces:
Dr GO - when you mentioned a G-2, is that "Gustat"? If so, have you compared the New G-1 and G-2 with each other? Thanks.
The G-2 is the Gustat copy. This was made by Kanstul 3-D copy of Miles Davis's Gustat Heim mouthpiece that was loaned to Kanstul by Wallace Roney. I have not played the G-1, as that did not have the V cup which was what intrigued me regarding the G-2.
@Dr-Mark said in Jaw Position and the Upper Register:
@Dr-GO
Okay, the use of more muscles in concert, the less fatigue.
But how is what you're doing not a modified "M" embouchure?
Not sure what this is. Please post a discussion and with diagrams how this embouchure works. Once I can review this I can discuss it. I looked over the internet and cannot find this embouchure.
@Kehaulani said in Jaw Position and the Upper Register:
A side-question - when you use the "M" embouchure coupled with pulling your muscles towards your eyes, do your lips ascend over your teeth?
Not exactly, but they are heading that way. My upper lips ascend about half way up my denture line. This really opens the embouchure more than a lower jaw drop can do. However, the lower jaw drop dose open the pharynx quit a bit more.
@Dr-Mark said in Jaw Position and the Upper Register:
@Dr-GO said in Jaw Position and the Upper Register:
There is 70% more muscle at play in the Vertical smile than the traditional lateral smile (the buzz smile).
I can not dispute or confirm that statement. How do you know that there is 70% more muscle at play? Can you support this claim? I'm not trying to be a smart-ass, I'm just wondering "why" 70%
Count the muscle fibers in use in the upper insertions on the zygimatic arch and the lateral fibers to the jaw. The upper has many more fiber inserts. See also my above post.
@Dr-Mark said in Jaw Position and the Upper Register:
@Dr-GO said in Jaw Position and the Upper Register:
When you use the vertical smile embouchure, the lower jaw is less a function in this equation. Those superior muscle insertion points take all the stress off the jaw it is that efficient!
I understand that in order to do the vertical smile, the person needs to smile toward the eyes which make the eyes buff out (not the lower jaw).
However, when I do it, what you describe is a modified "M" embouchure. I still form my lips by saying "M" and then, smile toward my eyes (vertical smile) This (to me) requires more work, not less and my jaw still reacts as it normally would for the various registers. How is using 70% MORE muscles (your percentage) more effective and efficient?
The more muscle working in consort, the less fatigue. Dr Mark, I taught muscle physiology at the Medical School for the past decade. This is a solid and clear concept from the Physiology Texts we had used over the years. Honestly!
@Kehaulani said in Tuning Tendencies:
You use a slide on C# and D? If I understand correctly, it's not that the player can bend notes down to that, artificially, but that the Committee is made so that one doesn't need to use the third-valve slide to compensate.
Back (an aside) to using a Committee in concert band, what mouthpiece are you using?
GREAT question as the mouthpiece DOES make a difference! I use the Kanstul G2. It works the best with this horn (as I have tried all my other pieces with it).
@Dr-Mark said in Tuning Tendencies:
@Dr-GO said in Tuning Tendencies:
Then he looked at me and said, "you don't even have one". I said to him to turn his tuner on. He did. I hit the D solid and his line went straight up.
Hi Dr-GO,
Using a hand held tuner to tune a band isn't in my opinion a wise thing to do. Tuners are good for guitars, and various string instruments but not for wind instruments. If you can play a Committee and not use the slides on a slow ballad or similar piece, that's great! I've not that skill. For me, I have to use the slides unless I'm playing a quick song or a modal type song where bends are welcome (Miles-ish).
Agreed. That's why it was HIS tuner not mine. I don't have one. I am not compulsive about intonation, I am adaptive to the concept.
@Kehaulani said in Tuning Tendencies:
Oh, just because the tone quality doesn't blend as readily with a section of legit-oriented horns, as well as it's slotting being loose. I have a Committee but usually use a Schilke in concert band. Just wondering.
I have had no trouble to directing the Committee's tone to blend well with the trumpet section in the concert band format. And that is sharing the 1st trumpet part with Bob Grey that plays a cornet. It really is a nice blend for the lead chair.
@Kehaulani said in Jaw Position and the Upper Register:
@Dr-GO said in Jaw Position and the Upper Register:
@Kehaulani said in Jaw Position and the Upper Register:
Could someone please tell me what a vertical embouchure is?
Do you mean that the muscles tense up-and-down as opposed to side-by-side? If this doesn't bring me closer just ignore it. Chalk it off to a dense old man.
Yes. Check out the muscle within the blue circle. The fibers are aligned up and down.
@Kehaulani said in Tuning Tendencies:
@Dr-GO said in Tuning Tendencies:
Dr. Mark, you don't have to play squirlly to get the Committee to play in tune . . . Bob Grey, a well known educator in Cincinnati and I played the first trumpet part in a concert band.
You use a Committee in concert band?
Yes. And Chris Botti uses it on classical pieces and neither of us use the third valve slide. Why does this shock you?
@Dr-Mark said in Jaw Position and the Upper Register:
@Dr-GO said in Jaw Position and the Upper Register:
When you use the vertical smile embouchure, the lower jaw is less a function in this equation. Those superior muscle insertion points take all the stress off the jaw it is that efficient!
Hi Dr.GO,
a. How does "those superior muscle insertion points take all the stress off the jaw"?
LOOK closely at the muscle insertions on the reference diagram. The more muscle insertions (on the Zygimatic arch) the less effort and energy is needed as a unit to lift the jaw. There is 70% more muscle at play in the Vertical smile than the traditional lateral smile (the buzz smile). LOOK AT THE DIAGRAM and study it. It makes perfect physiologic sense.
@Kehaulani said in Jaw Position and the Upper Register:
Could someone please tell me what a vertical embouchure is?
I have posted it THREE times, this is now the FOURTH: Please refer to post 11 under: Problems with Air and Nose https://www.trumpetboards.com/topic/398/problems-with-air-and-nose/17 to find my description, diagrams and video of me playing with the vertical smile. Make sure you focus on my cheeks to see the effect of the muscles I use.
@Dr-Mark said in Tuning Tendencies:
@Dr-GO said in Tuning Tendencies:
That rule does not apply to the Marten Committee. That horn has such dirty slotting, that the ear can feedback the ability to sound the note into tune without the need to use slide.
I have a 1953 Martin and yes, the sucker is squirrelly and I can lip it around like crazy but using the slides comes across a lot cleaner for me.
Dr. Mark, you don't have to play squirlly to get the Committee to play in tune on 1.3; 1,2,3 notes. Bob Grey, a well known educator in Cincinnati and I played the fist trumpet part in a concert band. He was yanking on the trumpets for not using their third valve slides on these noted. Then he looked at me and said, "you don't even have one". I said to him to turn his tuner on. He did. I hit the D solid and his line went straight up. He said: "I;ll be damned". I did not have to lip or squirl. You have to meet with me sometime and I will have to teach you how to play the Committee.
The jaw positioning IS probably more relevant for the frown embouchure were the insertion of muscles used in that technique is mostly at the lower jaw.
JUST REMEMBER, ONE SIZE DOES NOT FIT ALL
Once again, this only applies to the buzz (lateral smile) embouchure. When you use the vertical smile embouchure, the lower jaw is less a function in this equation. Those superior muscle insertion points take all the stress off the jaw it is that efficient!
@Dr-Mark said in Tuning Tendencies:
Thanks Trumpetsplus!
I wish I had a nickel everytime I had to say to a student, "Don't forget your slides!"
Thanks for your stamp of approval. It carries a lot of weight.
That rule does not apply to the Marten Committee. That horn has such dirty slotting, that the ear can feedback the ability to sound the note into tune without the need to use slide. Look at picture of Miles and Chris Botti when playing the Committee. Many of those pictures showing the artist plays those particular horns with the third valve slide ring removed. I too found this so true on my horn, and am now playing that horn tuning slide ring free.
@Dr-Mark said in Interesting composition tool: Impro-Visor:
Yes, listening to one's self can be down right painful.
Not necessarily so if you choose the right wine!
Let's link the above post to keep onto the subject of Range Improvement so readers do not think we digress:
So Dr. Mark is with the above lady and begins rubbing her belly and he starts chanting in his usual voice:
"I love you, I love you, I love you".
The lady says to Dr. Mark: "Lower"
So Dr. Mark reacts, deepens his voice to a lower Range and says:
"I love you, I love you, I love you".
In this case, Dr. Mark.... You need more practice!
