Opinions on Valve Oils?

Seth of Lagos

@flugelgirl said in Opinions on Valve Oils?:

... Many synthetics will react badly when mixed with other synthetics or petroleum products - I have had customers return instruments only to find out they mixed two brands of valve oil and there are beads of goo in all the pistons - really annoying, especially when the customer has caused damage I have to fix when they cannot get the pistons out!

Of course, I accept your observations without reservation. However, I don't keep a diary of which instruments I've lubricated with which oil and it could be any of a dozen or so. So over my 50+ year playing career I must have mixed all types of oil in all permutations. And yet I've never observed any of these adverse reactions between different oil types. Could it simply be a case of poor hygiene/maintenance routine? That would make both of our life experiences consistent.

Kehaulani

@flugelgirl.
So (and not being flippant) for the lazy you recommend Berp valve oil?
Which weight? I have all from new to one year old horns. Schilke, Getzen, Yamaha.
Thanks, Kehaulani.

My valve oil of choice is Latromba valve oil #1formula or Monster valve oil #1 formula.

oldpete

I use: Al Cass, Blue Juice...I used straight kerosene while in college. Dad had a service station with a kerosene pump.

tmd

@flugelgirl said in Opinions on Valve Oils?:

I find most of the synthetics to leave a lot of residue over time ....

Do you believe this is because synthetic oils have more additives?

Mike

neal085

@flugelgirl I'm not familiar with horn repair, but in the firearms industry it is common for customers to completely gum up the inner workings of a mechanism with incorrect cleaning products, or by mixing products, or just general poor maintenance.

It is also common for customers to then pretend like the problem was caused by something other than their maintenance habits.

On the trumpet oil, I've used both Ultra Pure and Monster in recent history, and have had good luck with both. I typically wipe out the valve block completely before applying oil.

flugelgirl

@Seth-of-Lagos Some of this might be poor hygiene, but like I said, I’ve seen it in brand new instruments as well. As I also said, there’s nothing wrong with using synthetics, but they do work better when horns are kept clean and do not sit for months at a time.

flugelgirl

@tmd No idea, maybe. Just what I’ve observed from horns I’ve worked on, from brand new to very used.

flugelgirl

@Kehaulani Berp is great for lazy maintenance, and for horns that spend time in storage. I find less residue in my own horns before cleaning, and though I clean more than most people do, my cleanings on my personal horns are not getting the strictly scheduled maintenance they did before I became a tech. Sometimes after a day of cleaning horns from grandma’s attic, I’d rather spend my time playing than cleaning my own.
As far as which formula, it depends on the age and condition of the horn. #1 works great on newer horns, #2 on those with minor wear, and #3 with heavy wear. #8 heavy rotor is great for 1st and 3rd slides. For synthetics users, a heavy rotor oil works great to keep 1st/3rd slides moving as well.

flugelgirl

BTW, Berp doesn’t pay me or give me free stuff - it’s just worked so well for me that I use it for everything that crosses my bench. My work is looking at becoming a dealer soon, so you will see it on our website soon if you shop with us.

adc

On flugelgirl's say so I ordered 8 oz of the #1. For comparison the Blue Juice is 1.99 cSt. This #1 is 2.2 cSt. I use BJ bc it seems to keep my horn the cleanest. But I have any number of old horns and some of them don't get played often. If flugelgirl is correct and residue is minimal with this horn..its worth a try. Thank you flugelgirl!!!

Kehaulani

@adc said in Opinions on Valve Oils?:

On flugelgirl's say so I ordered 8 oz of the #1. . I use BJ bc it seems to keep my horn the cleanest. . If flugelgirl is correct and residue is minimal with this horn..its worth a try. Thank you flugelgirl!!!

Yeah, I've been a long-time Hetman user but just ordered some BERP oil, too. I'll let you know how it goes.

grune

Thanks for opinions; valuable. This thread caused me to research the petrol/synth distinction, which brought me up to date. So, a correction; per today's standards, Cass is not synth [I suspect its base is condensate]. Overall, I find Cass to be a very good oil; odourless, clear, smooth, stable, long-lasting: but it is not fast per its label and claims. BERP is very intriguing. -regards,

GeorgeB

@Kehaulani

I'd use it but it's a pain having to order it from the USA at that stupid exchange rate. So far I haven't been able to find a Berp dealer in Canada. I don't have a beef with Hetman but I do admit to seeing some of that yellow stuff when my older horns sit to long unplayed.

Kehaulani

@ flugelgirl - I ordered some BERP oil. When it comes, can I use it straight away or should I clean my valves and casings, first. I use Hetman. Thanks.

flugelgirl

@Kehaulani Though I have not found it to react adversely, I ALWAYS recommend cleaning out old products before applying a new brand.

Kehaulani

@ flugelgirl, thanks.

adc

Got my BERP. I like it. Valve action is great. I am going to clean and oil my vintage Cornets (12 of them) in the near future!!

adc

Oiled 6 of12 of my vintage horns. So far so good!!!

Newell Post

I got a bottle of BERP several years ago for a vintage horn with worn valves. I got the thickest formulation and it is REALLY think. (Thicker than Hetmans's #3 or Monster's thickest, IMO.) It works well, but the action is pretty slow. However, I also hear they reformulated shortly thereafter and the newer BERPs might be faster.